Comparing Rating Systems, Help

[VBFOOL]

I've heard a lot about the Yankee rating system, personally I'm a Victorian rating system guy. Can anyone give me an idea of the comparison and why they does exist?

[NewEnglandRT]

As per www.yankee.org

As part of the effort to maximize opportunities for players, Yankee has instituted a system that rates individual players instead of teams (as in other USAV regions). Most USAV regions consist of member teams, each of which is rated according to the performance of the team. A player in these regions joins a team and must play with that same team for the entire season. In contrast, Yankee members join as individuals. Each player has an individual Yankee rating and a team's rating is computed from those of its players. This gives players flexibility and playing options, since a player can play several different levels of tournaments and can move between teams. Yankee also provides more levels (individual ratings from D to A+) than most regions (which provide team ratings of Open, A, BB, and B).

Many players new to Yankee (and some players that have been in Yankee for a while) are confused by Yankee's system for rating individual players. Yankee members are rated from D (beginner) to A+ (very advanced). The Yankee ratings sheet, copies of which are posted at every Yankee tournament, provides guidelines for calculating a player's rating. The sheet has categories for several volleyball skills, such as hitting, setting, passing, and defense. A player is rated in each category on a scale from 1 (D) to 10 (A+), the lowest is dropped and the highest is doubled. A chart on the sheet assigns the proper letter rating to the player based upon the point total. Copies of this sheet are posted at tournaments primarily for members to suggest new ratings for other players. However, the sheet can also be used by new Yankee members to compute their ratings, which they are asked to select upon joining Yankee.

Even with the rating sheet, however, it can be difficult for a new Yankee member to rate his own skills, e.g., to know whether his passing is worth a 3 (C), 4 (C+), or some other rating. Another way for a new Yankee member to select a rating is to find a current Yankee member with similar skills and select a rating close to his. As a general rule of thumb, a beginning player without much skill and only rudimentary knowledge of offense, defense, and strategy is a D. As this player gains more understanding of what is expected, but still without much skill, he will move up to C- and then to C. A C+ can generally play two positions well but is not necessarily consistent at all positions. Players at the B- through B+ levels are consistent at every position and have good court sense, with B+ being more skillful and smarter than B-. Players that play at the A- to A+ level are at the level of strong college level players.

Yankee has two ratings chairpersons who are the ultimate authority over each individual's rating and have the responsibility to maintain correct ratings across the Yankee membership as much as possible. A player can request a rating for himself and other players can suggest a rating on the rating sheets, but the rating chairpersons determine when a player's rating actually changes. A player who is "written up" at several tournaments often gets placed on the Yankee Membership Ratings Watch List until one of the ratings chairpersons has a chance to observe him.

When organizing a team for a Yankee tournament, the individual player ratings determine whether a team is eligible to play at a particular level and what players can make up a team for a particular tournament. The cumulative point values, i.e., 1 (D) to 10 (A+), of a team's six highest rated players must be no more than three points above the cumulative of a team consisting of players rated at the tournament level. In addition, no player on the team can be more than three levels above the tournament level. For example, a team playing at a C+ (point value of 4) tournament can have its highest rated six players totaling up to 27 points, i.e., 6*4 + 3. These points can be spread among the six players in any manner as long as no individual player is rated higher than B+ (three levels above the tournament level). A team consisting of three C+ and three B- players (27 points) and a team consisting of five C+ and one B+ players (27 points) are both eligible to play. However, a team consisting of two C+ and four B- players (28 points) and a team consisting of one C, four C+, and one A- players (27 points, but A- is four levels above C+) would both be ineligible to play in the C+ tournament.

Sorry for the novel... but it's not an easy question to answer. Most of the rest of the volleyball world uses the victorian (don't know where that comes from) system of rating. One neat feature is that you can write a player up if you feel/compute that they are underrated. We had a mixed sixes tournament that one of the refs was also a membership official and confirmed the write up and the team wasn't allowed to break pool. Hope the quote helps to clarify.I also would like to give a rough idea of the scale of things. A D has probably never played competative ball before (maybe played @ picknics/ recreationally, and an A+ would be just a step below international level. From what I hear some of the A+ teams could give the US National Team a run for their money!

[Glenn]

I just think the Victoria system is simpler, but I completely except the need for the Yankee system. Which one do you prefer?

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Volleyball Victoria Rating System

(Based on AVPNext http://www.avp.com)
The primary goal of a rating system is to help all outdoor volleyball
players better enjoy the game. This is achieved by providing a method
of classifying skill levels for more compatible matches, group
lessons, league play, tournaments and other programs.
Ratings are categorized by a letter and determine the level of skill
an athlete possesses. Volleyball Victoria recognizes the following
ratings:

Unrated
This player has little or no experience playing in tournaments. He/she
is still working primarily on getting the ball into play and needs on-
court experience. This player has obvious weaknesses in controlling
the ball but is familiar with the basic fundamentals of passing,
setting, hitting and serving. More advanced Unrated players are
quickly learning to judge where the ball is going, although court
coverage is weak. This player may also sustain a short rally of slow
pace with other players of the same ability.

B
This player has achieved improved ball control and dependability with
directional control on moderate shots, but still lacks depth and
variety. This player exhibits more aggressive net play, has improved
court coverage, and is developing defensive strategy.

A
This player has begun to master the use of power and shots and is
beginning to handle pace. He/she has sound footwork, can control depth
of shots, and is beginning to vary game plan according to opponents.

AA
This player has developed power and/or consistency as a major weapon.
He/she can vary strategies and styles of play in a competitive
situation and hits dependable shots in a stress situation.

AAA - Open
The AAA player typically has had intensive training for national
tournament competition at the semi-professional level.

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Team Overall Ratings

• RECREATIONAL: Low to moderate skill level, Skill improvement is a benefit & everyone has a great time!
• INTERMEDIATE-B / BB: Mix of players with moderate to average skill proficiency & game knowledge. Focus on skill improvement, working on the team concept & great sportsmanship!
• INTERMEDIATE-A: Mix of players with average to good skill proficiency & good game knowledge. Focus on evenly-matched, quality competition.
• COMPETITIVE-AA: Our more competitive, higher-skilled league offering. Majority of players have solid to high skill proficiency & game knowledge
• OPEN-AAA: Generally our most competitive, highest-skilled group of players. All players have very good to excellent skill proficiency & ability. Matches may be played with any gender breakdown (M/F) based on level. This is also the classification used (for rule interpretations, etc.) for leagues which are not specifically identified in any of the above categories.

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Other discussions on the topic:
Volleyball Victoria Rating System
Team Ratings Defined "Open, AA, A, BB. B, Recreational"

[mycena]

Yeah thanks for the info as well. I know what I am in Yankee since I play in tournaments but when people say they are AA and B I am still a bit confused about how well they actually play. The AVP rating seems a bit generalized. But maybe I am just a sciency type person and like the fact that you can crunch some numbers with the Yankee rating system to figure out where you fit. Can anyone who knows both systems match up the level between the two? (Aka Yankee C- thru C would be Victorian B or whatever)

[VBFOOL]

Originally Posted by mycena

Yeah thanks for the info as well. I know what I am in Yankee since I play in tournaments but when people say they are AA and B I am still a bit confused about how well they actually play. The AVP rating seems a bit generalized. But maybe I am just a sciency type person and like the fact that you can crunch some numbers with the Yankee rating system to figure out where you fit. Can anyone who knows both systems match up the level between the two? (Aka Yankee C- thru C would be Victorian B or whatever)

I don't know enough about the Yankee system to do the comparison. I wounder if some has the time to do the research, any volunteers?

[Glenn]

Originally Posted by mycena

Yeah thanks for the info as well. I know what I am in Yankee since I play in tournaments but when people say they are AA and B I am still a bit confused about how well they actually play. The AVP rating seems a bit generalized. But maybe I am just a sciency type person and like the fact that you can crunch some numbers with the Yankee rating system to figure out where you fit. Can anyone who knows both systems match up the level between the two? (Aka Yankee C- thru C would be Victorian B or whatever)

After all the upgrades this weekend I will create a comparison chart. The Yankee System is more detailed to a players level, where as the Victorian Rating System has a rating which is a range of skills for a teams overall level. I will up this tread once I complete the comparison.

Glenn

[Glenn]

Originally Posted by Glenn

After all the upgrades this weekend I will create a comparison chart. The Yankee System is more detailed to a players level, where as the Victorian Rating System has a rating which is a range of skills for a teams overall level. I will up this tread once I complete the comparison.

Glenn

I'm been so busy with VB and VBLI stuff I didn't get a chance to create the chart I will do it this week I promise, sorry.

Glenn

[mycena]

Oh sure we believe you. ;-)
Don't worry i promise I won't go up a level in ability until you get the chart created!

[NewEnglandRT]

Originally Posted by mycena

Oh sure we believe you. ;-)
Don't worry i promise I won't go up a level in ability until you get the chart created!

So in other words Glenn you've got plenty of time! - freebie!

[mycena]

So mean! So mean! Especially since I still see the minus attached to your rating! I can be mean too you know!! If I were still a setter I wouldn't set you tonight!